Story and Digital Mischief by Warrigal Mirriyuula.
As we grow older we have the opportunity to witness and ponder the shifts and changes in the world around us. To note what used to be called the “passing parade”; to see first our children and then our grandchildren grow up, as we too grow, travelling our various life and career paths.
This is such a commonplace experience and our musings such an ineluctable outcome thereof that it’s usually put down to the “human condition”, what Sartre called the existential dilemma. It all boils down to “how do we feel, how should we think, how should we act”?
Another commonplace is the notion that as we age our cognitive abilities wane. We take longer to recall memories accurately and can’t program the DVD, we misname people and endure what is often professionally described as “age appropriate” memory loss.
But is this slow decline into la la land real?
Not according to new research led by Dr. Michael Ramscar of Tübingen University. He and his colleagues’ recently published work in Journal Topics in Cognitive Science seems to put the lie to established ideas about older brains and declining cognitive acuity.
The team discovered that most standard cognitive measures, which date back to the early twentieth century, are flawed. “The human brain works slower in old age,” says Ramscar, “but only because we have stored more information over time.”
One of the things that stood out for me was that they discovered this new truth by teaching computers to “read books”. The books were a proxy for reality. What was “read” simulating the experiences of a life-time. The reading computers were then interrogated and tested for recall and comprehension.
When the computer was only allowed to read a small amount, subsequent cognitive test results were the equivalent of a young adult, but when the computer had accumulated the equivalent of a lifetimes reading over decades the cognitive test results looked like those of an older person. The computer was slower, not because its processing capacity had declined but because its data base had increased substantially and all that extra data, read life experience, took longer to process.
Technology now allows researchers to make quantitative estimates of the number of words an adult can be expected to learn across a lifetime, enabling the Tübingen team to separate the challenge that increasing knowledge poses to memory from the actual performance of memory itself.
“Imagine someone who knows two people’s birthdays and can recall them almost perfectly. Would you really want to say that person has a better memory than a person who knows the birthdays of 2000 people, but can ‘only’ match the right person to the right birthday nine times out of ten?” asks Ramscar.
The answer appears to be “no.” When Ramscar’s team trained their computer models on huge linguistic datasets, they found that standardized vocabulary tests, which are used to take account of the growth of knowledge in studies of aging, massively underestimate the size of adult vocabularies. It takes computers longer to search databases of words as their sizes grow, which is hardly surprising but may have important implications for our understanding of age-related slowdowns. The researchers found that to get their computers to replicate human performance in word recognition tests across adulthood, they had to keep their capacities the same. “Forget about forgetting,” explained Tübingen researcher Peter Hendrix, “if I wanted to get the computer to look like an older adult, I had to keep all the words it learned in memory and let them compete for attention.”
The research shows that studies of the problems older people have with recalling names suffer from a similar blind spot: there is a far greater variety of given names today than there were two generations ago. This cultural shift toward greater name diversity means the number of different names anyone learns over their lifetime has increased dramatically. The work shows how this makes locating a name in memory far harder than it used to be. Even for computers.
Ramscar and his colleagues’ work provides more than an explanation of why, in the light of all the extra information they have to process, we might expect older brains to seem slower and more forgetful than younger brains. Their work also shows how changes in test performance that have been taken as evidence for declining cognitive abilities in fact demonstrates older adults’ greater mastery of the knowledge they have acquired.
Take “paired-associate learning,” a commonly used cognitive test that involves learning to connect words like “up” to “down” or “necktie” to “cracker” in memory. Using Big Data sets to quantify how often different words appear together in English, the Tuebingen team show that younger adults do better when asked to learn to pair “up” with “down” than “necktie” and “cracker” because “up” and “down” appear in close proximity to one another more frequently. However, whereas older adults also understand which words don’t usually go together, young adults notice this less. When the researchers examined performance on this test across a range of word pairs that go together more and less in English, they found older adult’s scores to be far more closely attuned to the actual information in hundreds of millions of words of English than their younger counterparts.
As Prof. Harald Baayen, who heads the Alexander von Humboldt Quantitative Linguistics research group where the work was carried out puts it, “If you think linguistic skill involves something like being able to choose one word given another, younger adults seem to do better in this task. But, of course, proper understanding of language involves more than this. You have also to not put plausible but wrong pairs of words together. The fact that older adults find nonsense pairs—but not connected pairs—harder to learn than young adults simply demonstrates older adults’ much better understanding of language. They have to make more of an effort to learn unrelated word pairs because, unlike the youngsters, they know a lot about which words don’t belong together.”
The Tübingen researchers concluded that we need different tests for the cognitive abilities of older people—taking into account the nature and amount of information our brains process.
“The brains of older people do not get weak,” says Michael Ramscar. “On the contrary, they simply know more.”
A lot more!
Note: I took my title from the Thomas Hood Poem of the same name. My father used to regularly recite the poem when the issue of memory and remembering came up. Over time the portion quoted was reduced to the first four lines.
For me, now, it’s the last four lines that truly illuminate our subject here.
Source:
The above story is based on materials provided by Universitaet Tübingen and Science Daily.
Journal Reference:
Michael Ramscar, Peter Hendrix, Cyrus Shaoul, Petar Milin, Harald Baayen. The Myth of Cognitive Decline: Non-Linear Dynamics of Lifelong Learning. Topics in Cognitive Science, 2014; DOI: 10.1111/tops.12078

http://ht.ly/t2N8j
This should be a link to this same subject spruiked by another of my heros if I have transferred it properly. It should be to an Oliver Sacks link.
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Not to the Sacks link but to another article about the same.
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Or, this.
The future of farming in Aus. How we will have The Great Australian Industrial Revolution. However instead of starting off with chimney sweeps, beggars and slaves we can/should use these guys.
I came across this either from a link at The BBC, or The ABC and I was just thinking of how we could patrol vast tracts of land and irrigation delivery systems, for agrarian products. The real time photography and video would enable us to carry out remedial work and deliver fertilizer.
We’ll all be rich and “Live off the Robot’s Back”!
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oops, silly me. I found the link in my bookmarks (firefox), but fort to table it.
http://store.3drobotics.com/
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To keep your juices going, watch QI…………………………………
Or, Swallowed by a Black Hole: SBS. It’s on at 9:30 ch 130 Foxtel, however, I saw the earlier edition
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How many repeat editions of QI does anybody need to watch before we remember the dialogue off by heart, Jules? It gets easier certainly to remember the more it is played and gives me that self satisfied glow of remembering again (repeatedly).
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I had read about this before the article arrived. A great piece, BTW.
Of course I know so much that I can’t remember anything at all.
I think?
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Oh well – I came to the same conclusion as this article describes – that was about ten years ago. Just so much more stuff to remember. It does help to keep an active mind. Some oldies remember great detail from decades ago and much less from more recent years. (PS I do eat lots of oysters !)
Great article Warrigal and lovely that you have written here again.
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Bingo! You saying that reminds me aHa! I reckon you and me it was that swapped a comment about me having met a woman when I was worried silly about memory who introduced the thought to me. Whatever it saved me anxious hours of worry, 🙂
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Odd tangent alert.
If we’re talking about memory and Tubingen Uni here’s an odd thing. I can never remember the name ‘Tubingen’. I’ve been there. I’ve visited the museum at Tubingen University and seen there the world’s oldest surviving figurative art. Lonely Planet instructed me to “take a jolly punt ride on the Nekar”. But it was November and out of season so we missed out. I can quote Lonely Planet but I can’t remember the bloody name of the town. Ever!
I’ve been to Berlin, Potsdam, Regensburg, Zweisel, Berchtesgaden, Munich, Garmisher-Partenkirchen, Fussen, Konstanz, Ulm, Triberg, Stuttgart, Heidelberg and that university town with the punts and the world’s oldest figurative art.
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Sea Monster, ziss iss zee Pigss Armss! Vee don’t tangent hir!
—————————–
Cos he’s been everywhere, man,
He’s been everywhere, man.
‘Crossed the Rhine back there, man;
He’s breathed the Deutsche air, man.
Of travel he’s had his share, man.
He’s been ev’rywhere.
Been to:
Pottsdam, Konstanz, Zweisel, Berchtesgaden
Berlin, Ulm, Garmischer-Partenkirchen
Bavaria, München, Füssen, Stuttgart
That university town with punts and old figurative art
Which has a name he can never remember
Regensburg, Heidelberg, Triberg,
He’s been there
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Gone to Buggery as well?
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He’s gone to:
Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden,
Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden,
Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden,
Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden,
Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden,
Baden Baden, Baden Baden, Baden Baden,
He’s gone there.
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But has he been here:
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I have been to Baden-Baden. Left that out. I had to go there because Lonely Planet instructed me to visit Freidrichsbad. The rest of the family sat that one out. The nude bathing not the side trip to Baden-Baden. Only later did I discover those baths attracts the kind of person who (as reputation has it) does go to buggery. Lonely Planet was right though. The Frescoes are splendid.
Here’s a funny foreign misunderstanding story. I booked tickets from Heidelberg to Baden Baden. Did I want to pay extra to reserve seats on the ICE? Why not?
Took us ten minutes to find our reserved seats. Turned some very annoyed Germans out of them. Sat down. Heard announcement that we were coming up to our next interchange. Stood up.
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That humour you would have to spell out, Mr Showoff. If it’s worth it on second thought. It’s a loooong time since I’ve been to Germany, except for a brief nostalgia train trip across the Rhine to Freiburg for the Christmas markets.
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And apropos Nausea.
And memory.
I do remember being completely engrossed in Sartre at the same time that I was totally absorbed by Kazantzakis. I got to the former because the latter kept talking about him in his every essay and interview.
I’ve read Nausea and his other three novels which were a trilogy (wouldabeen tetralogy), The Age of Reason, The Reprieve and The Iron in the Soul, which I reckon was by far the most engaging of the three; at least to me.
That would have been around what? forty years ago?
But I still remember it all very vividly!
Such exhilarating reading, such demanding thinking, such elevating of the spirit, even though everything Sartre wrote was gloomy and dispiriting!
I remember the boiling in my brain, with such heady stuff as these two plus Homer and all the rest of the ancient and modern greek writers, coming so closely after all the french and the Russian writers I had read in Greek when I was in Greece and very soon after I arrived here.
I remember the shift from the religious crap my grandfather (a priest) and my uncle forced upon me! Not only an intellectual shift but a psychological/spiritual one, a moral one, a shift of faith, though my faith in monotheistic Christianity was always tentative and always coloured by the mythological religions.
I loved both, my grandfather and my uncle. Uncle still lives and I still love him, though in matters of religion, of course, we’re a few galaxies apart.
I remember wanting to be just like Sartre and Kazantzakis and the eagerness with which I’d sit down with pen and paper! Brain boiling, heart boiling, guts wrenched excruciatingly.
I remember all that and more.
I wonder how I’d compare with the memory in a microchip! Should I drink the ouzo of forgetfulness. Suck on the asphodels on the meadow outside the underworld? Tear all this out of my cotton pickin’ mind so I can remember the milk when I do the shopping?
Questions, questions!
Should I wear my trousers rolled?
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Thanks Warrigal, love your work. In the midst of all of these ‘brain games’, to stimulate us oldies comes some new research. Something that us piglets have known for a while. Reaing fiction improves brain connections: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-athletes-way/201401/reading-fiction-improves-brain-connectivity-and-function
Now we can all read in peace!
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That’s ‘reading’…forgot the ‘d’!
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The first four lines of the poem are quite vivid, perhaps the the last four lines are what we are to become or perhaps its just wisdom.
Maybe its right that we slow down like a computer as we get older our brains filled with more and more stuff. I used to be able to rattle off telephone numbers off the top of my head, hundreds of them, would struggle now, but I still know where to look them up.
Thanks for this Waz, so good to see you here..
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Apropos computers and nothing else:
Daughter was telling me yesterday why she caved in with Uni. The reason was that all of her work had to be done by spinning around from one website to the next, and before she could get to the actual text she needed to read, she had to learn a whole lot of puter argot and how to do what if she wanted to do one of the sixteen choices available on that site. She spent more time pondering about what to do and how to do it and on correcting the wrong clicks, then actually reading the relevant, educational material! She was highly interested in her subjects but she was absolutely frustrated from getting to them by this perpetual IT interference! She gave up.
Yesterday, I watched this deadhead who talked with the glee of a congenital moron about how computers are now the thing that everyone must learn, the suggestion being that all other knowledge is of secondary value to that of computer programming! Let the Primary school kids be taken out of their other classes to learn how to play with the gadgets of programming!
Utterly shameful!
I really don’t want to have to read a 4000 page manual on how to drive my little Honda. I just want to drive the bloody thing. In fact, I don’t even want to drive it. I want to get somewhere!
Let computer programming be chosen by those students, who, once they studied all other valuable subjects, can pick it up and study it to their heart’s content but let everyone else, those who want to study how to be human, for example, get on with studying subjects pertinent to that interest!
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Warrigal is in the house.
Warrigal from my Science days I dimly remember Physics, also Chemistry that was accorded respect by 2 out of 3 physicists, and Biology that was accepted as a legitimate Science by 2 out of 3 chemists. Ne’er a mention of Cognitive Science.
This thesis rests on the premise that human and computer memories are analogous. I thought it was accepted that they are not, except at the most superficial level. So there must have been a section or a reference to some other paper where they support the proposition that the analogy is legitimate for the purpose of this comparison?
————-
Another thought. Taking this at face value, if you can forget enough, eventually your memory will be equal to that of a twenty year old. Pass the scotch please.
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Dare I or dare I not, VoR? Dare I suggest that if memory becomes a burden then the best remedy, far better even than scotch or even Irish, is the ouzo. Two shots and you can choose which cells can be vacated; three and the choice is beginning to be taken away from you. By the end of the bottle, you won’t even remember what it was you were drinking.
The ultimate meadow of asphodels, the meadow where all earthly memory is erased and you are prepared for the afterlife… but I won’t go on with the mythology!
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When have you ever failed to dare to recommend ouzo as the universal remedy, atomou?
Most European countries seem to have their own style of rocket fuel. I’ve tried vodka, slivovitz (an old Croatian connection), whiskey, cognac, armagnac, and I THINK ouzo and out of the bunch whiskey is the least repelling to me … more due to familiarity from London days than any intrinsic worth I suspect. Although it could be that whiskey is less than the 99% proof I suspect the others of being.
On the other hand, I do enjoy cognac and armagnac and now ouzo, when used in cooking.
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Add genever to the list. Other spirits too, of course, but not neat.
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Hang on! Are we talking about effective memory erasers or pleasant beverages?
I was talking about the former. You are talking about the latter… which is on the tongue of the abuser.
In the very early years of our acquaintance, Mrs Ato and I used to frequent a very small restaurant in the city, the owner of which used to sit at his customers’ tables for a chat and invite a table at a time, to stay back after closing “for a little drink” He had invited us many times because we were good customers of his. I can’t remember where he was from, certainly somewhere in central europe, but his “little drink” was always slivovitz and the taking of it, would take hours! A wonderful chap who had an endless supply of juicy stories about european politics.
Slivovitz! No memory loss, except for how to work your legs afterwards!
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hello Voice, that was what I meant when I said below (very tired after travel) “the less information the younger” (implied, that you are and would get) ie forget (tee hee) about adding information, take it easy, get a hammock.
Far fetched on my part and facetious, but for the life of me it was a thought based on the concept we can compare computers and brains.
I think a long time ago in conversation we touched on the subject of memory in comments, Warrigal and (I think) then I referred to being relieved of worrying myself silly about memory by a woman who told me the complexity of information I accumulated would slow down my ability to immediately locate relevant information ie isolate one subject from another and related fact. I really thought of her comment as a helpful mental trick, that it provided entertainment and food for thought but …equating the human brain with the functioning of a computer wasn’t on the horizon.
Anyway, result of a reminder or other of the old chestnut about comparing apples and oranges, on this Wednesday last I gave the title ‘Comparing a blue one and orange ones’ to a photo I took of a frame of an advertisement on tv …here. Seems a coincidence.
http://www.blipfoto.com/entry/3899863
I head back on the bus tomorrow the four hour journey back to the rural isolation. I truly do back at base compare oranges and apples to decide which is the less exhausted looking simply to buy. Those are our consumer choices. They seem to be dumping all their seconds stock or cast off scraps on us out in the boondocks …where we have one supermarket and Adelaide is the bright lights. 🙂
Looking forward to hearing more of you Warrigal.
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Yes, I missed that aspect of what you said before sandshoe. Great minds think alike! (And occasionally so do we. 🙂 )
It’s not just about comparing apples with oranges, it’s about drawing inferences about how apples function from how oranges function. It might be valid for some aspects but you have to make a case for it, not just assume it. It’s like comparing car engines. You can compare power but you can’t form valid conclusions about how one car engine will react to unleaded petrol from how another car engine reacts unless they are the same type of car engine.
Sherlock Holmes certainly operated on that principle that the more information you acquire the harder it is to retrieve. When told the earth revolves about the sun he promptly set out to forget it so as not to clutter up his mind with stuff that didn’t help him solve crime. I guess that was really Sir Arthur Conan Doyle’s idea of course. He also believed in fairies.
Not that I write off the idea itself. It’s a good idea and worth exploring.
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As for fresh fruit and vegies in the country. I dunno. Thinking about it off the top of my head, transport costs could easily be higher to Bordertown because everything is organised around supplying the biggest market (Adelaide). I googled Bordertown and produce and got a lot of entries about grain, so I’m guessing that’s what’s mainly grown around there. Which is hardly going to help!
Sometimes it makes no sense at all. Maybe 25 years ago I visited a fishing town quite far north of Sydney on a driving trip to nowhere in particular, and expected to be able to eat fresh fish. There was nowhere in the town to buy it – all shipped down to Sydney. The local fish and chip shop, which I thought was a cert, used frozen fish.
My brother lives near Nurioopta and they have a really good story around that region, with Farmer’s Markets, locally produced goods (such as dried fruit) co-ops etc. All underpinned no doubt by the wine industry attracting a critical mass of people who are interested in food and a ready made market of tourists to sell it to.
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I misspelled Nuri. Years ago I heard it pronounced with the p and the t in that order.
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Thank you for a comprehensive response, Voice tossing some ideas. An abbatoir processing lambs and a seed business are two other industries here, Voice. There is an agricultural machinery industry and workshops. We have local oats. Market gardens seem far and few between. Yes, no wine industry immediately here re the observation about the wine industry being attractive of people and foodies. I reckon the equation of fruit and vegetables and (other items) ie quality of them compared with how many shopfronts in town that truly are a supermarket (one) explains it. I wonder if it doesn’t matter a lot if the produce is as cheap as can be found. Half dead by the time it goes out on the shelf. Prices are not dramatically different in regard to grocery items and very occasionally are cheaper is my observation. The lack of choice and variety impact coming back from the supermarkets of the big smoke.
A rural town is vulnerable at the best of times and certainly the transport organisation is enormous getting stuff here. I know the frequency of enormous food transports is high as they go by my door (and 13 goods trains travel through a day). Deaths from cancer rates in the rural environment of South Australia compared with Adelaide will give pause for consideration, Voice, that something really is missing from the organisation of people and goods and services, 9 times higher I heard quoted recently. I will know more about these figures soon as I am going back to engagement in consumer health activism and to meetings in Adelaide catching up on my old crowd there. Have been to a few and really looking forward to re-engagement.
Nuri’s spelling as Nurioopta recalls hostipal. 🙂
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Implication is that the less information the younger? The fewer the lines is the answer? Tee hee. A cosmetic breakthrough for computers. Secret of their achieving eternal youth. Big step for thinkers, piglets. Ease up on the adding information. So much less to forget. Elevate the feet. Get a hammock.
I’m seriously challenged. Falling asleep from brain strain & travel. O Lordy nobody done know the trouble I’ve seen. 😉 That thunking tired me all up. Goodnight for tonight.
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Thanks for the article Warrigal. My previous comment was for the general public. It wasn’t addressed to you particularly:)
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Waz, absolutely delightful to see your name and your work again after this hiatus. I missed you terribly but I’ve also been very busy myself so I’m equally culpable truancy wise.
I’m not sure what to make of this article, since it dumps all youth and all adults in their but singular hessian bag, as if all youth and all adults are the same – in IQ, in life’s experience, in fact gathering over their lives. People who live in remote areas, for example, with little access to facts other than those they deal with in their small lives -ie, smaller than say adults who work in places where information is, perhaps, by comparison, mountainous on a daily basis, would have less “data” in their head to sift through, before they “recall” something.
In other words, these remote denizens (remote not only geographically and socially but also intellectually) would have far less “sifting time” to deal with, thus their recall should be, according to this report much quicker than that of their counterparts. I doubt that. To put it crudely, dummies will take longer than smarties.
The same with the youth. The youth who is constantly cramming data into his head would, according to the Tübingen researchers, find it more difficult to recall bits of it than the youth who is, say barely interested in collecting any data.
What, also, of the intellectually challenged youth?
To come to the conclusion, “forget about forgetting,” seems to me, from this report anyhow, a rather rash, if nor brash and bold conclusion to come to. As Sir Humphrey Appleby would say, it’s a rather courageous thing to say!
No?
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Solution is easy: Blackmores Odorless Fish oil 1000. Take one capsule after each meal. 3 times a day.
If you don’t like fish oil then eat oysters…lots of oysters.
I have a cure for itchy haemorrhoids too. 🙂
(no I didn’t have any:)
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What was that doctors name again?
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Waz, did the researchers use new or old computers ?
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He can’t remember
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I will be away for a couple of days. Tonight when my hostess has gone to bed I will be curling up on the hospitable couch catching up with this this … drawn in by the illus. immediately. Fell off my chair almost I guffawed so loud. What a great heap of laughs I have enjoyed at the Arms this last week and now this one to travel on Lol. Thank you Waz and that’s only the art. 🙂
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Yes, I loved the caption. What does being grown up feel like….does anyone know?
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George Harrison’s widow reckoned GH lit up the room when he died, Big M. The implication was George cracked his life goal of growing up and achieving the best death possible. My word, I felt inadequate. I’ll be kickin’ and caterwaulin’ makin’ an inappropriate ass of myself, protestin’ I just knew it when she described George’s attainment. Something’s not happening there for me, Big M. 😉
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So….you haven’t grown up, either?
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